10 August 2012

Citybus Planned

I never did finish the look at the proposed service changes for Plymouth Citybus so lets do that now:

Service 27/28
  • Service 27: Torpoint Ferry to City Centre part of the current 27 to be renamed service 33.
  • Service 27 will be renamed 28, from the City Centre to Eggbuckland will follow the current 28 route between City Centre and Derriford to incorporate Deer Park. Operate every 30 minutes during the day and hourly evenings and Sunday’s. New link to Derriford Hospital from Deer Park and improved Sunday Service.
  • Service 28: 28 to be renamed 27. 28A renamed 28 and 28B Removed. Operated every 30 minutes during the day and hourly evenings and Sundays. New link to Derriford from Blandford Road (Efford). Service 27 and 28 to operate every 15 minutes from City Centre to Derriford via Eggbuckland

This looks like an improvement for Deer Park at least.

  • Service 29: 29/S Service 29 to be increased in frequency from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes during the day and hourly at night. Sunday day  service to be every 30 minutes. 29 will return back into Crownhill to provide a link to Crownhill for residents in West Park and Honicknowle.
  • Service 13: New Saturday service timetable to operate, based on the Monday to Friday timetable

Bit of a surprise but a welcome one!

  • Service 16B: to be replaced with service 16. Sunday service increased from hourly to every 30 minutes. Increased evening service to hourly each day.
  • Service 34: Service re timed to improve reliability in peak times, and introduce an evening service. Service extended to Estover Industrial Estate Monday to Saturday and additional services on Sundays.

Nice to see an evening service again. Its also good to see the extension to Estover Industrial Estate although its not exactly been good hunting ground for any bus operator before.

  • Service 40/41: Replaced with service 43 and increased to every 10 minutes daytimes Mon – Sat and 20 mins on Sunday. Evening services will be up to every 30 mins Mon – Sat and hourly on Sunday’s. The service will also link to the Life Centre and railway station as it will run from Southway to City Centre and then from City Centre to Ernesettle. The Southway loop will go from Dunnet Road to Clittaford Road, then Southway drive to Clittaford Road then back to Dunnet Road and back to the City centre and on to Ernesettle.
  • Service 43: No change to Ernesettle to City Centre, but then linked with service 40/41 (see service 40/41). Link created for Ernesettle to Drakes Circus and Mutley Plain on the way out to Southway.

Citybus had to clarify these changes: We apologise for the confusion over the proposed route changes to the Southway services as reported in the Evening Herald on Sauturday 14th July 2012. The only proposed change to the route will be for it to operate via Dunnet Road, Clittaford Road (Falstaff), Southway Drive, Clittfaford Road and back down Dunnet Road, in a consistent one-way loop upto every ten minutes. The service will then continue to operate to the city centre via Crownhill, Mutley Plain and North Hill, and NOT via Ernesettle. The proposal is for the bus to continue through as a 43, so that when you arrive at the city centre as normal from Southway, you can stay on the same bus if you wish to head towards Milehouse (for the life centre) or even St Budeaux or Ernesettle. You will not have to travel to Southway via Ernesettle.

Its good that this was clarified as it wasn't  that clear in the original article. Seems like a good idea to join the two as an easy way of providing additional cross city links

  • Service 43B: Current route will continue to St Budeaux Square, but will then link with service 16 along Western Mill Hill and North Prospect providing a link to Scott Hospital and Beacon Park and rejoin Wolseley Road opposite the Co-op and continue into the City Centre.
  • Service 44: Service retimed and adjusted to make it more reliable and the return of evening services to Whitleigh on Sundays.

It is good to see more evening services return after some severe cut backs over the last few years

  • Service 50: Service made more reliable with no through-working onto service 61/62. City Centre to Marsh Mills to operate via Laira instead of Prince Rock and has been extended to Derriford Business Park. Daytime Mon – Sat 15 minute service and 30 minute evenings and Sunday service. Service will also serve Marjons.

Mmm. Citybus have already stated that it will stay with the present route to the City Centre and NOT through Laira as originally detailed. This is a good move as this was upsetting a lot of people when it was announced. I reserve judgement on the extension into the Derriford Business Park. On the face of it its great for me as I work on the Park but this estate has been served by several route before, non of them successful! Hopefully by having it as an extension of the route rather than a diversion off route into the City Centre will give it a chance. I hope that the plan is to serve Marjon only on the way back into Derriford from the Business Park as a one way loop. If they try to serve the college on the way into Derriford I can see it annoying a lot of Derriford bound passengers. It will also play havoc with the timetables as we see all to often with the 15.

  • Service 61: Service 61 to be retimed to improve reliability with the section between Transit Way and Derriford Hospital withdrawn. Service will operate from Transit Way to Brake Farm, changing to a service 62 and carrying on to the City Centre. 20 minute service Mon – Sat daytime and hourly in the evening. Sunday service up to every 30 minutes. 61S withdrawn. Combined 61 and 62 service having a frequency into the City Centre of every 10 minutes Mon – Sat and 15 minutes on a Sunday.
  • Service 62: As above with service 61, retimed to improve reliability, combining with the 61 to make a Mon – Sat 10 minute frequency.

This is one which seems to have annoyed a few people as they do loose the useful Derriford link.

 



 citybus-herald-map-2

Of course all of these plans were open to consultation and it does seem that they were genuinely interested in what passengers thought, which is all to often not the case with consultations! We have already seen them agree to put the 50 back through Embankment road and not through Laira as they originally suggested. It is now with Citybus as they put the final pieces together and come up with the new network which they hope will prove to be popular with passengers. After a few years of cutbacks it really does seem that Citybus are wanting to expand again and grow the business. We already know that the new 45 is starting at the end of September so its quite likely that the other changes will happen at the same time, in which case we could be seeing the new route registrations going through VOSA fairly soon. Watch this space!


Bloggers

  • It would take until the end of the known universe to list the mistakes and general horrors in the various lists of Sheffield "onward journey" possibilities on the National Rail web site. Public Transport Experience
  • Plymouth Citybus’ new managing director has wasted no time. This week he’s published the new 45, a half-hourly service between Plymouth and Ivybridge that competes head-on with both First and Stagecoach. It also takes Citybus outside the old Joint Services boundary, again. One wonders what else he might do Omnibuses
  • Saturday 4th August saw a small gathering of ancient relics take place at Whittlesea market place for the Morley's 90th anniversary event, Andys Bus Blog

23 comments:

  1. Just noticed the 31 seems to have "disappeared". Is that linked to the eye infirmary closing?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I don't think the 31 was going to change. It never appears on the PCB route map of services like the 49 so seems to have been forgotten.

      Delete
  2. 31 and 49 are tendered routes so would not have been included in any revisions. Whilst Graham's article is excellent as always readers need to remember that none of the proposals have been finalised - except the already published 45 service to Ivybridge. I understand that Citybus are taking their proposed new timetables to the areas involved again next week using chatterbus.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks for the kind comments!

      I hope I have made it clear that this is all "up in the air" and things can and will probably change. The map was produced by Citybus to show the proposed changes rather than the whole network.

      Delete
  3. I am concerned about the supposed increase of buses in Transit Way. Especially in the final run-up to Christmas it's not uncommon at all for Citybus to suspend their buses in there due to congestion, and now with the 29 being every 20 minutes and 61/62 being every 10 minutes, it'll be them that are causing the congestion! Perhaps an additional bus stop needs to be placed either side of the roundabout, have one outside Argos and another one on the other side of the road, and maybe have every other 61/62 go as far as there, while having the 29s going all the way through as it'll supposedly go to Crownhill & Derriford.

    Not heard of the Chatterbus coming out again with timetables etc next week, how did you find that out? Just wondering!

    ReplyDelete
  4. With the end of the 22 and the 50 now going back to Embankment Road I'm assuming this now means no Citybus service at all on Old Laira Road between Efford Lane and Embankment/Plymouth Road? I used to travel this way on a regular basis and the bus stops along this section always seemed to be pretty well used. Still seems odd that one 21 per hour (each way) can't travel this route.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Yes there will. The 8 and 9s will still use it and the new 20 (42) will operate via Alexandra Road and Lipson Vale if that route goes through.

    ReplyDelete
  6. More details:

    http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/about-us/news/planned-autumn-2012-service-change

    ReplyDelete
  7. Here’s what I think of the new routes, probably in two or more posts.

    5/A - No change - not surprised really.
    8 & 9 - No 8A/C/D - will probably cause some inconvenience to passengers.
    16 - said to be one of the most unreliable services Citybus operate. Taking the 2 deckers off it in April has been a big improvement, though there's still some way to go yet. Journeys from 4.20 onwards really need a decker, I saw a B7 on the 1625 16 to Kings Tamerton a few days before Christmas last year which was near enough completely full. Withdrawal of 16B shouldn't be a problem as the 43B will operate evenings, plus being a much more direct service. Every 30 minutes on Sundays is an improvement and will greatly increase the frequency of services to and from Milehouse on Sundays along with the other 43s.

    Service 20 - what a transformation!! I personally wouldn't run evening services on Sundays as I believe demand would be extremely limited. The link to Mudge Way is a very welcome return for me (and loads of other passengers for that matter!). All I ask for is a link to Mudge Way and a Sunday service.

    Service 21/22 - the timetable looks very confusing. It seems like they may have been reading comments on this site as the 21A route number is in place. St Maurice do get an evening service on Sundays so this will be welcomed. Less so will be the reduction in frequency for Chaddlewood. It's still every 10 minutes along Mudge Way/Plymouth Road etc, though what is clear is the huge reduction in services to Steer Park. They get the 20, but only from 9AM-3PM!! There's this peak '21B' which takes a direct route along Glen Road, missing out Mudge Way etc though coming back from town a 1655/1705 journey is definitely needed! 1755 isn't exactly what I'd call a peak time!

    23/24, 25 - minor timetable changes.

    26 - still every 10 minutes, most continuing from the 21/A, with evening services on Sundays being every 30 minutes, yet another move against First! They have to do something, they can't just let Citybus 'walk over them'.

    27 & 28/A/B. Another confusing looking timetable. A big improvement for Deer Park with evening services, though both make for a longer journey for passengers from Eggbuckland/Crownhill/Derriford. Provides two extra links to Derriford which can't be bad, aswell as increasing evening services in Eggbuckland to two an hour. Serving Crownhill is a welcome return, as since the end of July service change to operating inbound via Plumer Road, this was 4 buses an hour lost from Derriford to Crownhill.

    29 - remains at every 30 minutes, though serves Crownhill. I know I've said it loads of times before, though this is a significant decrease in the level of service from Transit Way to Crownhill & Derriford. When it was going to be every 20 minutes, then it wasn't too bad; now, at least one of the 61 or 62s should to to at least Crownhill.

    33 - doesn't look like a very profitable service!

    34 - Interesting as they're not all going to the Industrial Estate anymore. It does see some early morning services terminating at Derriford which is better than nothing.

    35 - Return of evening services on Sundays is a welcome move, though are listed as starting from the Railway Station so presumably this will come from a 29/43/A/B?

    36 - Loss of the first and last journeys - must be being withdrawn for a reason so shouldn't be too much of a problem.

    ReplyDelete
  8. 40 & 41 - this is interesting. The proposed 43 has been scrapped (though 40 & 41s will continue as a 43), and instead they'll have their current, familiar 40 and 41. Should ease a lot of confusion as most passengers will get off at Royal Parade anyway. Return of Sunday evening services is a welcome move, being a more direct service than the current 42 which stops off at Derriford first.

    42 - Probably the most confusing looking timetable. Some terminate at and start from Derriford, which does make for 4 direct buses an hour, with it being every 30 minutes from Tamerton, one being the direct 42, one being the non-direct one via Southway, the 42A.

    43 - No real changes other than continuing from and to the 40/41 and Sunday evening services being every 30 minutes. A big increase in frequency for the St Budeaux corridor on Sunday evenings.

    43A - Sunday service should be welcomed by many, and again will improve the frequency of services along the Milehouse-St Budeaux corridor on Sundays. Another move against First!

    43B - Again, evening services are a welcome addition, especially on Sunday'; Holly Park residents now have a direct service as opposed to the 16B, which A takes a lengthly route an B terminates at Whitleigh Green.

    44/A - No real changes other than the welcome return of Sunday evening services, as opposed to the 16B which takes a very 'indirect' route and only serves part of Whitleigh. These Sunday evening services are also an addition to services to Crownhill on Sunday evenings.

    46 - The route number is interesting. It says it will replace 'he recently withdrawn connections between Ernesttle Whitleigh Southway to Derriford Hospital.'. I didn't know that Target had made changes to the route? I'm sure I've seen a 46/47 at Derriford the other day displaying 'Ernesettle'. Is this replacing journeys Target have withdrawn? As I say, I really don't know the story behind Citybus' phrasing saying the links from Ernesettle etc to Derriford have been withdrawn, and would be grateful if anyone could shed some light on it. Will be a useful service though.

    50 - Another unreliable service, mainly because of the through-working to and from the 61/62s. I must admit this is a useful part of the service, having used it myself as a link from Marsh Mills to Transit Way, though it comes at the expense of reliability. 10 minute layovers in the City Centre should do the trick though! Sunday evening services are a welcome addition.

    61 & 62 - Yet another confusing looking timetable! Yo can read my comments on the 29 to find out what I think about the loss of the Derriford section, plus I'm sure you've all heard it several times before. It's a big improvement for St Pancras Avenue though. This will lead to lots more buses in Transit Way which will cause congestion, and you've heard my thoughts on that enough times aswell! Can't see there being very high demand for buses in Transit Way at 11PM on Sundays though!

    152 - Minor timetable changes.

    It does seem like other than maybe a few minor amendments, this is pretty much the final thing, and I expect all the routes to start up. Note the wording also:

    'These services has been re-timed and re-routed to improve reliability, the section of route between Transit Way and Derriford Hospital has been withdrawn '

    'Service 50
    This Service has been retimed'

    'Service 43B
    Evening services are being introduced'.

    'Service 43
    (Sundays have been extensively retimed) '

    'We are now entering the final stages of planning for our network changes for Plymouth.'

    That last one is a good example 'for our network changes', not 'proposed network changes'.
    Certainly sounds like they're going through with them. A new network map is up aswell.
    http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/download/22085.7/august-2012-network-map/

    ReplyDelete
  9. Here’s what I think of the new routes, probably in two or more posts.

    5/A - No change - not surprised really.
    8 & 9 - No 8A/C/D - will probably cause some inconvenience to passengers.
    16 - said to be one of the most unreliable services Citybus operate. Taking the 2 deckers off it in April has been a big improvement, though there's still some way to go yet. Journeys from 4.20 onwards really need a decker, I saw a B7 on the 1625 16 to Kings Tamerton a few days before Christmas last year which was near enough completely full. Withdrawal of 16B shouldn't be a problem as the 43B will operate evenings, plus being a much more direct service. Every 30 minutes on Sundays is an improvement and will greatly increase the frequency of services to and from Milehouse on Sundays along with the other 43s.

    Service 20 - what a transformation!! I personally wouldn't run evening services on Sundays as I believe demand would be extremely limited. The link to Mudge Way is a very welcome return for me (and loads of other passengers for that matter!). All I ask for is a link to Mudge Way and a Sunday service.

    Service 21/22 - the timetable looks very confusing. It seems like they may have been reading comments on this site as the 21A route number is in place. St Maurice do get an evening service on Sundays so this will be welcomed. Less so will be the reduction in frequency for Chaddlewood. It's still every 10 minutes along Mudge Way/Plymouth Road etc, though what is clear is the huge reduction in services to Steer Park. They get the 20, but only from 9AM-3PM!! There's this peak '21B' which takes a direct route along Glen Road, missing out Mudge Way etc though coming back from town a 1655/1705 journey is definitely needed! 1755 isn't exactly what I'd call a peak time!

    23/24, 25 - minor timetable changes.

    26 - still every 10 minutes, most continuing from the 21/A, with evening services on Sundays being every 30 minutes, yet another move against First! They have to do something, they can't just let Citybus 'walk over them'.

    27 & 28/A/B. Another confusing looking timetable. A big improvement for Deer Park with evening services, though both make for a longer journey for passengers from Eggbuckland/Crownhill/Derriford. Provides two extra links to Derriford which can't be bad, aswell as increasing evening services in Eggbuckland to two an hour. Serving Crownhill is a welcome return, as since the end of July service change to operating inbound via Plumer Road, this was 4 buses an hour lost from Derriford to Crownhill.

    29 - remains at every 30 minutes, though serves Crownhill. I know I've said it loads of times before, though this is a significant decrease in the level of service from Transit Way to Crownhill & Derriford. When it was going to be every 20 minutes, then it wasn't too bad; now, at least one of the 61 or 62s should to to at least Crownhill.

    33 - doesn't look like a very profitable service!

    34 - Interesting as they're not all going to the Industrial Estate anymore. It does see some early morning services terminating at Derriford which is better than nothing.

    35 - Return of evening services on Sundays is a welcome move, though are listed as starting from the Railway Station so presumably this will come from a 29/43/A/B?

    36 - Loss of the first and last journeys - must be being withdrawn for a reason so shouldn't be too much of a problem.

    ReplyDelete
  10. 40 & 41 - this is interesting. The proposed 43 has been scrapped (though 40 & 41s will continue as a 43), and instead they'll have their current, familiar 40 and 41. Should ease a lot of confusion as most passengers will get off at Royal Parade anyway. Return of Sunday evening services is a welcome move, being a more direct service than the current 42 which stops off at Derriford first.

    42 - Probably the most confusing looking timetable. Some terminate at and start from Derriford, which does make for 4 direct buses an hour, with it being every 30 minutes from Tamerton, one being the direct 42, one being the non-direct one via Southway, the 42A.

    43 - No real changes other than continuing from and to the 40/41 and Sunday evening services being every 30 minutes. A big increase in frequency for the St Budeaux corridor on Sunday evenings.

    43A - Sunday service should be welcomed by many, and again will improve the frequency of services along the Milehouse-St Budeaux corridor on Sundays. Another move against First!

    43B - Again, evening services are a welcome addition, especially on Sunday'; Holly Park residents now have a direct service as opposed to the 16B, which A takes a lengthly route an B terminates at Whitleigh Green.

    44/A - No real changes other than the welcome return of Sunday evening services, as opposed to the 16B which takes a very 'indirect' route and only serves part of Whitleigh. These Sunday evening services are also an addition to services to Crownhill on Sunday evenings.

    46 - The route number is interesting. It says it will replace 'he recently withdrawn connections between Ernesttle Whitleigh Southway to Derriford Hospital.'. I didn't know that Target had made changes to the route? I'm sure I've seen a 46/47 at Derriford the other day displaying 'Ernesettle'. Is this replacing journeys Target have withdrawn? As I say, I really don't know the story behind Citybus' phrasing saying the links from Ernesettle etc to Derriford have been withdrawn, and would be grateful if anyone could shed some light on it. Will be a useful service though.

    50 - Another unreliable service, mainly because of the through-working to and from the 61/62s. I must admit this is a useful part of the service, having used it myself as a link from Marsh Mills to Transit Way, though it comes at the expense of reliability. 10 minute layovers in the City Centre should do the trick though! Sunday evening services are a welcome addition.

    61 & 62 - Yet another confusing looking timetable! Yo can read my comments on the 29 to find out what I think about the loss of the Derriford section, plus I'm sure you've all heard it several times before. It's a big improvement for St Pancras Avenue though. This will lead to lots more buses in Transit Way which will cause congestion, and you've heard my thoughts on that enough times aswell! Can't see there being very high demand for buses in Transit Way at 11PM on Sundays though!

    152 - Minor timetable changes.

    It does seem like other than maybe a few minor amendments, this is pretty much the final thing, and I expect all the routes to start up. Note the wording also:

    'These services has been re-timed and re-routed to improve reliability, the section of route between Transit Way and Derriford Hospital has been withdrawn '

    'Service 50
    This Service has been retimed'

    'Service 43B
    Evening services are being introduced'.

    'Service 43
    (Sundays have been extensively retimed) '

    'We are now entering the final stages of planning for our network changes for Plymouth.'

    That last one is a good example 'for our network changes', not 'proposed network changes'.
    Certainly sounds like they're going through with them. A new network map is up aswell.
    http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/download/22085.7/august-2012-network-map/

    ReplyDelete
  11. 40 & 41 - this is interesting. The proposed 43 has been scrapped (though 40 & 41s will continue as a 43), and instead they'll have their current, familiar 40 and 41. Should ease a lot of confusion as most passengers will get off at Royal Parade anyway. Return of Sunday evening services is a welcome move, being a more direct service than the current 42 which stops off at Derriford first.

    42 - Probably the most confusing looking timetable. Some terminate at and start from Derriford, which does make for 4 direct buses an hour, with it being every 30 minutes from Tamerton, one being the direct 42, one being the non-direct one via Southway, the 42A.

    43 - No real changes other than continuing from and to the 40/41 and Sunday evening services being every 30 minutes. A big increase in frequency for the St Budeaux corridor on Sunday evenings.

    43A - Sunday service should be welcomed by many, and again will improve the frequency of services along the Milehouse-St Budeaux corridor on Sundays. Another move against First!

    43B - Again, evening services are a welcome addition, especially on Sunday'; Holly Park residents now have a direct service as opposed to the 16B, which A takes a lengthly route an B terminates at Whitleigh Green.

    44/A - No real changes other than the welcome return of Sunday evening services, as opposed to the 16B which takes a very 'indirect' route and only serves part of Whitleigh. These Sunday evening services are also an addition to services to Crownhill on Sunday evenings.

    46 - The route number is interesting. It says it will replace 'he recently withdrawn connections between Ernesttle Whitleigh Southway to Derriford Hospital.'. I didn't know that Target had made changes to the route? I'm sure I've seen a 46/47 at Derriford the other day displaying 'Ernesettle'. Is this replacing journeys Target have withdrawn? As I say, I really don't know the story behind Citybus' phrasing saying the links from Ernesettle etc to Derriford have been withdrawn, and would be grateful if anyone could shed some light on it. Will be a useful service though.

    50 - Another unreliable service, mainly because of the through-working to and from the 61/62s. I must admit this is a useful part of the service, having used it myself as a link from Marsh Mills to Transit Way, though it comes at the expense of reliability. 10 minute layovers in the City Centre should do the trick though! Sunday evening services are a welcome addition.

    61 & 62 - Yet another confusing looking timetable! Yo can read my comments on the 29 to find out what I think about the loss of the Derriford section, plus I'm sure you've all heard it several times before. It's a big improvement for St Pancras Avenue though. This will lead to lots more buses in Transit Way which will cause congestion, and you've heard my thoughts on that enough times aswell! Can't see there being very high demand for buses in Transit Way at 11PM on Sundays though!

    152 - Minor timetable changes.

    It does seem like other than maybe a few minor amendments, this is pretty much the final thing, and I expect all the routes to start up. Note the wording also:

    'These services has been re-timed and re-routed to improve reliability, the section of route between Transit Way and Derriford Hospital has been withdrawn '

    'Service 50
    This Service has been retimed'

    'Service 43B
    Evening services are being introduced'.

    'Service 43
    (Sundays have been extensively retimed) '

    'We are now entering the final stages of planning for our network changes for Plymouth.'

    That last one is a good example 'for our network changes', not 'proposed network changes'.
    Certainly sounds like they're going through with them. A new network map is up aswell.
    http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/download/22085.7/august-2012-network-map/

    ReplyDelete
  12. Interesting improvememts to servives i see the xtra 42 betweem derriford and city as an attrmpt to kill off first number 15 and the 26 likewise with the 3. Surely first need to retaliate here?

    ReplyDelete
  13. Jus seen the proposed new timetables on Citybus website...some look good but with some of the frequencies I can not see how it can operate viably, they would bankrupt themselves with empty buses,,,for example 61/62 every 15 mins in the Sunday daytime...half hourly at night until gone midnight can't see that paying!!!

    ReplyDelete
  14. Hopefully this'll work this time, tried 5 times!

    40 & 41 - this is interesting. The proposed 43 has been scrapped (though 40 & 41s will continue as a 43), and instead they'll have their current, familiar 40 and 41. Should ease a lot of confusion as most passengers will get off at Royal Parade anyway. Return of Sunday evening services is a welcome move, being a more direct service than the current 42 which stops off at Derriford first.

    42 - Probably the most confusing looking timetable. Some terminate at and start from Derriford, which does make for 4 direct buses an hour, with it being every 30 minutes from Tamerton, one being the direct 42, one being the non-direct one via Southway, the 42A.

    43 - No real changes other than continuing from and to the 40/41 and Sunday evening services being every 30 minutes. A big increase in frequency for the St Budeaux corridor on Sunday evenings.

    43A - Sunday service should be welcomed by many, and again will improve the frequency of services along the Milehouse-St Budeaux corridor on Sundays. Another move against First!

    43B - Again, evening services are a welcome addition, especially on Sunday'; Holly Park residents now have a direct service as opposed to the 16B, which A takes a lengthly route an B terminates at Whitleigh Green.

    44/A - No real changes other than the welcome return of Sunday evening services, as opposed to the 16B which takes a very 'indirect' route and only serves part of Whitleigh. These Sunday evening services are also an addition to services to Crownhill on Sunday evenings.

    46 - The route number is interesting. It says it will replace 'he recently withdrawn connections between Ernesttle Whitleigh Southway to Derriford Hospital.'. I didn't know that Target had made changes to the route? I'm sure I've seen a 46/47 at Derriford the other day displaying 'Ernesettle'. Is this replacing journeys Target have withdrawn? As I say, I really don't know the story behind Citybus' phrasing saying the links from Ernesettle etc to Derriford have been withdrawn, and would be grateful if anyone could shed some light on it. Will be a useful service though.

    50 - Another unreliable service, mainly because of the through-working to and from the 61/62s. I must admit this is a useful part of the service, having used it myself as a link from Marsh Mills to Transit Way, though it comes at the expense of reliability. 10 minute layovers in the City Centre should do the trick though! Sunday evening services are a welcome addition.

    61 & 62 - Yet another confusing looking timetable! Yo can read my comments on the 29 to find out what I think about the loss of the Derriford section, plus I'm sure you've all heard it several times before. It's a big improvement for St Pancras Avenue though. This will lead to lots more buses in Transit Way which will cause congestion, and you've heard my thoughts on that enough times aswell! Can't see there being very high demand for buses in Transit Way at 11PM on Sundays though!

    152 - Minor timetable changes.

    It does seem like other than maybe a few minor amendments, this is pretty much the final thing, and I expect all the routes to start up. Note the wording also:

    'Service 43B
    Evening services are being introduced'.

    'Service 43
    (Sundays have been extensively retimed) '

    'We are now entering the final stages of planning for our network changes for Plymouth.'

    That last one is a good example 'for our network changes', not 'proposed network changes'.
    Certainly sounds like they're going through with them. A new network map is up aswell.
    http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/download/22085.7/august-2012-network-map/

    I think they've overdone it a bit. Late night evening services on the 20 surely can't last long!

    ReplyDelete
  15. Really happy about the Saltash services and the through to Ivybridge!!

    What will happen to Targets 46/46? Seems pointless just going from Ernesettle to Derriford.

    The 45 then will have the B7's then if they've come off the 43A,

    Quite like their changes, good job PCB, no doubt some things, certainly the Sunday Saltash will knock First out, especially at every 30mins.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Having seen what appears to be Plymouth Citybus's confirmed changed for this autumn it looks like they have stepped back from the more radical changes they had planned.

    When you distill all of the changes though it appears that those areas served by PCB will have either the same or less than they have today. No area of the city appears to be getting an improved service from what I can see - yes maybe in terms of Sunday and evening services on some routes, but lets face it that's only really bringing what has been a lamentable offering from PCB during these times towards something verging on adequacy.

    Oh and I've forgotten the 46. Derriford Hospital to Ernesettle - is it going to be operated with a vehicle allocation of 1 seems tight on the timetable! This route will not last and will be dumped probably I bet at the end of the year.

    PCB mooted an increase in frequency for the 29, the 43b to divert via Weston Mill, the 34 to extend to Estover Industrial Estate all of which doesn't appear to have materialised.

    Although there will be cross city routes they will have different numbers! To do this successfully they should have the same number. So when travelling from Milehouse your 43 will change to a 40 or will it be a 41 to take you to Southway? Personally I would have stuck to my guns with the 43 idea and the 10 minute loop around Southway.

    The losers are Chaddlewood - less buses, Higher Compton - half the number of buses to the Bluebird, Eggbuckland generally from a slower route either going via Lower Compton or Deer Park.

    The area set to gain was outside the consultation area completely - Ivybridge already served by First. So PCB slightly down the resource in Plymouth to attack First. First really need to fight back but they also need public support. It's clear to me what PCBs tactics are here, see First off and control the whole of Plymouth and its environs. That would be a disaster for the passenger.

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    1. So what will or can first do in response. Where do they expand? I would operate eggbuckand, crownhill, mutley,city every 20 mins and increase current ugo15 to every 15 mins to combate new citybus 42.

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    2. For First it has to be a step process to competition. Firstly secure their existing territory, then target one or two areas of vulnerability with new services which would ideally be extensions of the existing Ugobus network. The last step should see be to look to serve all principal areas of the city.

      So for phase 1 identify weaknesses in the current First empire. I'd rehash frequencies in Plymstock. Increase the 6 and 7s frequencies to every 15 minutes each, with services operating every 30 minutes in the evenings and on Sundays. Up the 2 to every 10 minutes again with buses every 30 minutes in the evening and on Sundays.

      Increase the 1 and 1A again to a combined frequency of 7/8 minutes with evening and Sundays at a combined frequency of 15 minutes.

      Increase the 3s evening and Sundays service to every 15 minutes. Also increase the 4 to every 30 minutes on evenings and Sundays. Introduce an evening and Sunday service at every 30 minutes on the 5.

      The reason for investing in the margins (I.e. Sundays and evenings) is to ensure that passengers see a real commitment to service so when choosing to buy season tickets clearly see that the service First offer will be superior to that of PCB. An increase to the 2s frequency is to attempt to prevent an attack, the 1, 1A will secure more market along Wolseley Road and St Budeaux.

      For the 15 I would look to place this route to every 15 minutes but after Mainstone it will run via Leigham, Austin Farm and Higher Compton and Mutley Plain to the City Centre with another route operating in reverse with the same frequency. It may need a renumbering we can call it 15/15a for now. It would again go every 30 minutes in the evening and on Sundays.

      I would add a direct route to Woolwell like the old 7 every 30 minutes - the 85 no need for the 84/86 to then divert. The combined frequency then from Derriford Hospital to Crownhill and Mutley and the City would be every 7/8 minutes on the 15/84/85/86.

      I would increase the inner zone fare area out to include Plymstock, Crownhill, Derriford Hospital and Estover. I think this has been successful in Barne Barton.

      Phase 2 would be a target of Eggbuckland, Efford and Plympton. Bring back the old 12!! etc

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  17. The 46 and 33 seems like routes that have been dumped/shoved to the bottom of the pile, and I can't see either of them seeing the year out. Increased frequency on the 29 is definitely needed though!

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    1. the should bring back the 46 from where live it wood be easy for me from millford lane we have no bus routes for derrford hospital and and estover southway and city centre whitliegh
      its very bad sunday serivce whitliegh had a good service when we had the 47a and 46a for derrford hospital and 47 that useto go in the city centre bring back 147 for devonport in town centre 146 route for workers

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  18. The 146/147/246/247 were indeed very useful services and would be a welcome but unlikely return. Having visited the Chatterbus again, the latest proposal/timetables etc are pretty much the finished piece, just one or two minor changes will probably be made and will be all done by roughly this time next month. If you're reading this thanks very much for answering my questions Brian! Much appreciated.

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